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Girlie
#1 Posted : Tuesday, March 29, 2011 3:38:53 PM(UTC)
Girlie


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From what I've read here and elsewhere, it sounds like most people begin a gathering attempt by hitting in the middle. I do it a little differently, but I didn't figure there was any useful reason why. Below I quoted a post from Truvy out of this thread for reference. The conversation was about guessing where the items would be based on information from the remainder bar, but using this standard way doesn't really make that so useful.

Anyway, I realized that I make those guesses a lot, though in a small way, and my method of gathering makes it work.

I split up the bar/circle into 1/6 pieces, where the middle point sits in the middle of one, leaving a 1/12 on each side. In percents, it looks like this: [-8--25--42--58--75--92-].

My first two hits are at 42 and 58. These spots are easy to estimate. On botany, it's just across from the top and bottom of the bubble on the left side of the wedge. On mining, it's just inside and just outside of the middle line. On fishing, it's each side of the word "jig".


After that, I do it the same as everyone else. The reason I feel this way works better for me is the fact that I'm starting off to one side or the other. For example, when I'm hunting for silver, I always start with the spot just inside the circle. More often than I would if hitting right in the center, I either make it in one hit, or get the "close enough, hit it once more" message.

I also find that nearly everything lands close enough to the center that I seldom need to resort to the two extremes (8% and 92%). Because my hits are a little closer together, I think I also get more direct successes and fewer prompts to hit the same spot a second time. I couldn't say this for certain without documenting it vigorously, but it seems to make numerical sense.

Assuming the item is at one of the absolute extremes (far enough extreme that I have to hit 8/92 twice), I end up with one more hit to make. However, discounting the two hit fails such as raw gems, I haven't had any problem with beating the remainder bar.

Speaking of gems, those are almost always very close to the center, so I go straight for 15-25% when the remainder bar comes up very short. Documenting preferred locations for two hit fail items would probably be a worthwhile endeavor.

Truvy wrote:
This has been seen in my various data collections as well. Its close to an 80% reliability of a given fish having a 'prefered' jig location followed by a 'reel in' location.

It doesn't seem to be affected by quality or quantity though, just a randomizer on occasion to thorw it off.

While it's tempting to fish in a mannor to guess what fish will be on the line and try to jig at their reel in location, i tend to find that approach leads to more losses.

Typically I follow this:

[0--10---35--50--70---90]

1) 1st Jig : @ [50%]
2) 2nd Jig:
A) if message was "The fish has tired, but you still cannot reel it in."
then: Hit at exact same spot [50%]
B) If the above message doesn't happen, then there is just the normal "You have hooked soemthing but can't reel it in". Jig @ [35%]

3) 3rd Jig
A) if message was "The fish has tired, but you still cannot reel it in."
then: Hit at exact same spot [35%]
B) if message was "You take in some line" {GOING THE RIGHT WAY}
then: goto Step 4
C) if message was "The fish is taking line" {GOING THE WRONG WAY}
then: goto Step 5

4) 4th Jig (Right way)
Jig @ [10%] one of 2 things will happen:
A) You will reel in the fish
B) You will get the message The fish has tired, but you still cannot reel it in."
then: Hit at exact same spot [10%] (You WILL reel in the fish this time)

5) 4th Jig (Wrong way)
Jig @ [70%] one of 3 things will happen:
A) You will reel in the fish
B) You will get the message The fish has tired, but you still cannot reel it in."
then: Hit at exact same spot [10%] (You WILL reel in the fish this time)
C) You will get the message "You take in some line"
then: goto Step 6

6) 5th jig (Last Jig)
Jig @ [90%] one of 3 things will happen:
A) You will reel in the fish
B) You will get the message The fish has tired, but you still cannot reel it in."
then: Hit at exact same spot [10%] (You WILL reel in the fish this time IF you have enough remainder for another jig)
C) You will lose the fish (Not enough remainder left. If you can't make this 5th jig, then you need to:

* Increase your Fishing Level
* Increase your Dex
* Wear maximum "Gathering"
* Repair your gear
* Eat "Gathering" food (Cooked Vegie Dishes)
* Change to a lower Grade of water
* Target a Lower Rank fish

Edited by user Tuesday, March 29, 2011 3:59:15 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Add a bit about gems

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Vicious on 4/4/2011(UTC)
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Girlie
#2 Posted : Tuesday, March 29, 2011 5:11:31 PM(UTC)
Girlie


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Question for others about this: do you find that you can be less precise when gathering lower ranked items? For example, when I'm fishing on grade 6 nodes--catching low rank fish--it seems to be that I can spread this out to quarters [-12--37--63--88-] without any trouble. However, when I do this on higher ranked items, I can end up with false directions sometimes (hit 37, 63 is farther, but 12 is farther still, find the item at 47). I don't have this problem when I run 6ths.
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Vicious on 4/4/2011(UTC)
Truvy
#3 Posted : Thursday, March 31, 2011 5:40:56 AM(UTC)
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There certainly is a 'cushion' so to speak as your skill improves and the rank of the fish lowers. No idea what that scale is etc, but that's also part of why i use simple and broad units of measure for my gathering...its pretty forgiving actually.
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Vicious on 4/4/2011(UTC)
Purplenv
#4 Posted : Thursday, March 31, 2011 1:03:00 PM(UTC)
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lol,

Ammusing it is, with lowbie DoL players making information posts.


For the mini-game (swingbar etc), if things are seeming overly random, for even the same items being harvested, then it would be advisable for the player to invest in STR/VIT/DEX, the one that coresponds with the skill they are using.

Any evaluation of where items fall during this game is completely offset by these stats. Anything less then 80, with 100 being much closer to ideal, is useless.

The next step for efficiency during this game is knowing the exact loot table for the node(s) you are hitting. This information has been readily availble for a long time, and once you've gotten a few results from any node, you should be able to determine which loot table you are hitting, at the very least, for the next time you come back to it.

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Vicious on 4/4/2011(UTC)
Vicious
#5 Posted : Monday, April 04, 2011 6:26:43 AM(UTC)
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Nothing wrong with anyone making information posts higher or low.

thank you everyone for your input.

Girlie
#6 Posted : Monday, April 04, 2011 11:07:33 AM(UTC)
Girlie


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Just to clarify what you are saying here, Purplenv...

So if you gather with low points in Strength for Mining, for instance, that makes the lie of the item in the mini-game more random? I wouldn't know anything about that, since I started gathering after PL 50, but it sounds like useful information none-the-less.
Purplenv
#7 Posted : Monday, April 04, 2011 2:25:14 PM(UTC)
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Yes. Low STR, incase you play a caster DoM, or whaterver other stat allocation you want to make, will dramatically effect the random nature of the mini game.

It's VIT for mining though.
STR for Botany, and DEX for Fishing.

Even at PL50 you won't have 100 pts in all STR/VIT/DEX.

Also keeping in mind that MND increased mining yield.
INT for Botany yield.
PIE for fishing yield.

So there is a fairly tricky ballancing act to get the stats just right for the skills you will use most. This is also why they asked in the poll a while aback, about changing up the way stat points are allocated, since class is so dynamic, it would seem they want the stat points to be as well.

Edited by user Monday, April 04, 2011 2:28:05 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Chevalier
#8 Posted : Monday, April 04, 2011 5:38:47 PM(UTC)
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I thought PIE was only taken into account for Spearfishing? My DEX is pumped sky high, and I've ignored basically PIE since I never spearfish.

Edit:

Is there a stat cap for R50? My DEX is 150+29= 179.

http://lodestone.finalfa...er/status?cicuid=1572751

Edited by user Monday, April 04, 2011 5:41:12 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Purplenv
#9 Posted : Monday, April 11, 2011 6:44:40 AM(UTC)
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Chevalier wrote:
I thought PIE was only taken into account for Spearfishing? My DEX is pumped sky high, and I've ignored basically PIE since I never spearfish.

Edit:

Is there a stat cap for R50? My DEX is 150+29= 179.

http://lodestone.finalfa...er/status?cicuid=1572751


Yes there is a cap. Additionally, stats cost more at higher ranks.

When the stats for DoL were posted some people ASSumed that the stats worked the same as was described for DoH, in that one stat was for primary hand, and the other was for OH. This was a false ASSumption.

I guarentee pumping up PIE will boost the number of 3 yield casts you get while fishing, especially for high rank fish like Black Sole, and other desirable items.
Girlie
#10 Posted : Saturday, April 16, 2011 12:31:20 PM(UTC)
Girlie


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Purplenv wrote:
When the stats for DoL were posted some people ASSumed that the stats worked the same as was described for DoH, in that one stat was for primary hand, and the other was for OH. This was a false ASSumption.


Aye, there's good reason why the two tables were set up differently. Smile

I don't have much use for the low grade ores, though, so I don't see any reason to allocate points to MND while I'm ranking. That makes it easy to keep the other attributes around 90. Once I take mining high enough to gather the gold I want, however, I can see where I'll have that problem...

Oh, and right on the vitality for mining. I always confuse that one because it seems like a mini-game about how much power you are putting into the swing should be governed by something that would determine how much power you are putting into each swing. But that would make sense, and we can't have that. Wink

Edited by user Saturday, April 16, 2011 12:36:24 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Purplenv
#11 Posted : Thursday, April 21, 2011 1:21:33 PM(UTC)
Purplenv


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Girlie wrote:
I don't have much use for the low grade ores, though, so I don't see any reason to allocate points to MND while I'm ranking. That makes it easy to keep the other attributes around 90. Once I take mining high enough to gather the gold I want, however, I can see where I'll have that problem...



Ammusing part is Mythril and Gold are hardcapped at 1, so yes, I agree that MND is the least important stat to have high, for a triple-threat DoL player.

In comparison, the only wood that is hardcapped at 1 is Mahogany Log.
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Girlie on 4/24/2011(UTC)
Girlie
#12 Posted : Sunday, April 24, 2011 1:15:49 AM(UTC)
Girlie


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Good to know about the mythril and gold. That being the case, I won't worry about reallocating anytime soon.
r4ver2z
#13 Posted : Thursday, May 05, 2011 4:15:15 PM(UTC)
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Just to add in some experiences Ive had with the secondary stats and gathering. For a while i went sky high with my Dex and let the others all fall. But in the end my pulls were far and few between. This is where i am happy that my roommate was at the same pool, same level for both within 1 or 2 levels max. Same gear, same lures, same jigging locations. And after testing us side by side he ended up with about 75-80% yeild vs my 40-45% pull rate. After trying this for a while i decided to see what would happen if i reallocated points back into piety as well. So after taking my piety from 35-90 i saw a dramatic pull difference. This was all at the same location with no gear changes or buff changes with 100-80% gear so no change other then stats. And i saw my bite rate increase to around 75% after the stat change. So roughly 30% more bites for 55 points of piety. Not that bad in my opinion. And im happy to have had someone to real time base it off of. Use the info as you will but this was my experience.ThumpUp
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