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Niya
#1 Posted : Wednesday, December 28, 2011 8:00:39 PM(UTC)
Niya


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A while back i stumbled upon one of the new additions to mooglebox.com, a site with "gathering information". Content was new to me and really interesting, that any item you can mine/log has a specific remainder bar length and strike zone. I've tried it out during the last week while doing the G1 & G2 achievements for mining, and i have to say, it works really well.

One thing that has to be noted (it's mentioned on the MB page, but i want to repeat it here) is that it only works when your level and class-relevant stats are above the grade you are working with, otherwise the items will just hop between random spots.

With this knowledge you can put something together that i'd call a "grade thumbprint" (hey, i'm not native english and couldn't come up with a better name Flapper) for a certain area. I'll use the letter/number scheme that MB also uses.

So, for example, the "thumbprint" for the grade 2 mining spots around Emerald moss would be:
A: strike zone 2 -> raw sunstone, raw malachite
C: 2 -> zinc ore, minium
D: 3 -> silex

For G3 (Tranquil) it is
A: 2 -> raw garnet/peridot
C: 2 -> silver/zinc ore
C: 3 -> alumen

That way it gets really easy to predict what item you get and where on the gauge you have to hit in order to obtain it. Can speed things up quite a bit when you don't have to "search" the strike zones for the right spot BigGrin

Big thanks to Jet Chan (the one running mooglebox) and Aviha Chai for getting all this info together! And i hope some of you will find it useful as well ^^
 1 user thanked Niya for this useful post.
Hooch on 2/27/2012(UTC)
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Kida
#2 Posted : Thursday, December 29, 2011 1:41:24 AM(UTC)
Kida


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Hi Niya and welcome to the boards. Saw you on the Intro thread but haven't replied yet... now I do it here instead :D

This has been mentioned before and indeed it seems very relevant. I am currently looking into how to add this information to the site and find out exactly how it all should be put together.

Thanks for bringing it to our attention and please post any information that may be relevant for implementing this. That goes for all of you :D Let me know how this would best work out for you.

Also check out this post: http://www.disciplesofth...m.aspx?g=posts&t=629 which discusses the same topic.
Niya
#3 Posted : Thursday, December 29, 2011 6:48:15 AM(UTC)
Niya


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Hehe, thanks for the welcome ^^
I've already seen that parts of this were mentioned in the mining guides and that Raldo has a complete list (with % values) for botany in his spreadsheet. Just haven't found a full list for botany and mining (well, excluding the mooglebox page xD).

Integrating all this into the main page will probably be quite a challenge when you don't want to overload it with too much information. After all it needs some explanation, the raw remainder/strike zone values would be easy to integrate but hardly anyone would understand them xD
I'll try to think of something... ^^
Raldo
#4 Posted : Thursday, December 29, 2011 9:27:26 AM(UTC)
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I think mooglebox's 4~5 strike/chop/jig spots are insufficient to describe where items are located, but the information is helpful none the less. I use percentages in my spreadsheet so I can display more chop areas and so people don't have to reference a chart so they know which letter/number associates to which chop point.

I love how mooglebox has 5 chop zones listed for botany, but none of the items use chop zone 5.

Edited by user Thursday, December 29, 2011 10:01:32 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Orophin
#5 Posted : Thursday, December 29, 2011 10:30:19 AM(UTC)
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I dunno, I've been documenting the jig spots of fish as I've been doing them and the 5 spots seem to work out ok. Like I know Northern Pike and Ala Mhigan Fighting Fish bite on far left, Yugr'am Salmon and the Corals bite far right, and then a multitude of fish bite in between.

It requires having a chart in front of you, or a really good memory to know what's biting when based on the stamina bar though. I have one of those crazy memories for useless stuff, so I'll know in some areas that there can be three different fish with the same stamina bar and know where to jig until I get a catch.
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Raldo
#6 Posted : Thursday, December 29, 2011 1:13:28 PM(UTC)
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I would say there are 9 potential targets; one every 12.5% (1/8 of the bar). In my spreadsheet I usually just round these numbers up or down a bit, since .5% looks ugly.

1 - 0%
2 - 12.5%
3 - 25%
4 - 37.5%
5 - 50%
6 - 62.5%
7 - 75%
8 - 87.5%
9 - 100%

Due to the margin of error allowed, adjacent targets will often overlap, allowing it to seem like fewer actual targets.

My best evidence for this is Maple Logs, which will fail if you hit 49% or around 76%. This leads me to believe there is some point between the two. That being said, Maple Sap seems to work from 35%~55%, which doesn't really fit any category perfectly.

Could be wrong. /shrug

Edited by user Thursday, December 29, 2011 3:23:00 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Courtney
#7 Posted : Friday, December 30, 2011 7:02:13 PM(UTC)
Courtney


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I think stats affect the actual width of the band, but not the actual midpoint. Also, when you are low compared to the item you're mining, you get the "you sense something but can't extract" message for the highest items at least, and that may be if you're not quite in the range for extracting the item. Originally, I got this message from T5 points, particularly for mythril. Now (at 41) I get mythril out first hit about half the time, so its extraction point seems to be getting wider as my stats go up.
Raldo
#8 Posted : Saturday, December 31, 2011 1:52:54 PM(UTC)
Raldo


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The "you sense something but you can't extract it" means that you're hitting the correct spot, you just haven't depleted the remainder bar yet in order to get the item. Your gathering stat affects how much the remainder bar is depleted for correct hits and how much it is not depleted for missed hits.

I do agree with you that the size of the strike/chop/jig target is likely affected by one or more stats.

Edited by user Saturday, December 31, 2011 1:53:44 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Jet
#9 Posted : Sunday, February 05, 2012 10:46:37 PM(UTC)
Jet


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Hey everyone. Sorry to chime in late here (5 weeks late >.<) but for some reason in my lurking I missed this thread.

Anyway, let me know if you'd like to use my data for strike zone and remainder bar, Kida. I know Raldo proposes there are more strike zones (I don't have a strong opinion here... I don't have high enough DoH stats to get very crazy about testing the strike zones (the consistency of the strike zone is really related to whether or not you have a high enough stat)), so I don't know if you want to use those, but the remainder bar is pretty straightforward.

mooglebox.com :: FFXIV Power Database and Tools
Raldo
#10 Posted : Sunday, February 05, 2012 10:54:51 PM(UTC)
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Off topic: Do you have any place to submit corrections for Mooglebox, Jet? I have one super-unimportant thing I found wrong while I was flipping through your gathering data. There are a number of botany offhand items with an incorrect max yield (La Noscean Lettuce has a max yield of 3 -- still looking through the rest of your data).

Love the site ThumpUp

Edit: Don't want to reply, since this is off-topic, but I sent you an email with the full list of corrections.

Edited by user Sunday, February 05, 2012 11:33:10 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Jet
#11 Posted : Sunday, February 05, 2012 10:58:25 PM(UTC)
Jet


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Thanks Raldo. Hate to talk mb here too much, but in the future you can always send a note to jetchan@mooglebox.com. Thanks for the lettuce tip ;) I'll make the change.

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